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 Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness

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MagnetMan
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PostSubject: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Mon Feb 02, 2009 8:42 pm

There is no way that I can detect that the video on the UTUBE link I give below may be faked in any way.
When you view it I think you will agree that it radically alters our consciousness as regards human relationships with Mother Nature.
The video shows a young elephant painting the portrait of an elephant
The execution of the painting, from start to its incredible final spiritual touch is as thoughtful and as masterful as anything a Picasso could produce.
It reveals a consciousness that, in essence, is no different from ours
The fact that I once hunted and killed them is freaking me out to a large extent.

There are no words I can use to describe the impact that the elephant drawing has had on my consciousness
In the space of ten minutes it altered my entire world view.
Just for starters, from a personal behavioral aspect it has immediately and radically altered my own attitude towards eating the flesh of any animal. I have suddenly and irrevocably become a vegetarian.
I now feel that commercial animal slaughter it is akin to murder, mass genocide in fact.
I would be greatly interested to know if it strikes anybody else the same way.
Here is the link again for those who have not seen it.

I would be greatly interested to know if it impacts anybody else as profoundly as it has me.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=He7Ge7Sogrk&e
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Mon Feb 02, 2009 11:42 pm

It says "Video no loinger available."

Maybe it isn't true?
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Tue Feb 03, 2009 12:00 am

MagnetMan wrote:
The execution of the painting, from start to its incredible final spiritual touch is as thoughtful and as masterful as anything a Picasso could produce.
Picasso??? -- I am not so sure about that...


MagnetMan wrote:
It reveals a consciousness that, in essence, is no different from ours
I actually-agree with this statement. Mammals are very closely-linked on the genetic scale, compared to saayyyy ... insects, etc.
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Tue Feb 03, 2009 5:09 am

Vegetarianism won't help.

In order to raise the plantations they have to clear fields which are a part of a complex eco-system, thus killing many little animals or destroying their homes.

Even plants are "life" in that they use energy from their surroundings to create order. So, ignoring the legal connotations, you "murder" plants as well - in any case you do kill them.

Your ideals are in conflict with reality.
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Tue Feb 03, 2009 8:59 am

Unreasonable wrote:
MagnetMan wrote:
The execution of the painting, from start to its incredible final spiritual touch is as thoughtful and as masterful as anything a Picasso could produce.
Picasso??? -- I am not so sure about that...


Here is a critique from my brother. He has been a professional artist and set designer in Hollywood for the past twenty years.

The amazing thing about the elephant's art, is that she drew it from an abstract single line starting from the trunk to the hind foot, inclined for perspective of it's elevation from the ground. Then repeated that incline again for the forefoot on the same side, The flower was incredible. Two daubs of paint, red on the tip and yellow on the body of the brush and she fan painted the flower head floating in space with a 'hot' center ... the whole image is a romantic ballet ... a dancing elephant. Divine inspiration? Perhaps, but one thing for certain, she painted like a pro ... no different than Picasso. Express the line ... fill in the details.

If any person wants to decide that all of that technique was accomplished by a mahout pulling on an elephant's ear and that the animal had little to do with it, you are entirely free to do so. What I do know from my art classes is that it is incredibly difficult to get a bunch of artistically inept, analytically indoctrinated intellectuals to accomplish anything that remotely approaches art. That elephant class did just that. And if anybody does not find that reaching into the depths of their psyche then I am indeed sorry for the heartfelt numbness of our specie.

Advocatus Diaboli wrote:


Vegetarianism won't help.

In order to raise the plantations they have to clear fields which are a part of a complex eco-system, thus killing many little animals or destroying their homes.

That is what we had to do in the Bronze Age and the iron Age in order to survive. In the Nuclear Age we have the technology to leave nature entirely alone. We can farm indoors. Now that we have that capacity, anything less is murder.

Quote :
Even plants are "life" in that they use energy from their surroundings to create order. So, ignoring the legal connotations, you "murder" plants as well - in any case you do kill them.

That is true. They have a sexual life just like us. Every plant should be allowed to complete its life cycle (from seed to seed) before it is consumed. Cereal grains, fruit and nuts are an ethical diet.

Quote :
Your ideals are in conflict with reality.
A highly evolved soul can survive on the calories provided by sunlight and air. Hows that for reality. Basketball
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Tue Feb 03, 2009 11:51 am

If you want to farm "indoors", you have to make an "indoors". That requires an imposition which would have an effect on the area around it. You would certainly have to kill bugs.

Do you have an immune system? If you do, you're killing things.

Your ethics are nonsense.
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Tue Feb 03, 2009 12:48 pm

Advocatus Diaboli wrote:
If you want to farm "indoors", you have to make an "indoors". That requires an imposition which would have an effect on the area around it. You would certainly have to kill bugs.

Do you have an immune system? If you do, you're killing things.

Your ethics are nonsense.

You are entitled to your opinion, mate. But being rude about it is unethical. pig
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Tue Feb 03, 2009 1:45 pm

See, now you try to gain favour with me by making a joke and referring to me as your 'mate'. It's not a bad tactic and I actually used to fall for it in the past; but, these days, my identification with and compassion for the weak and stupid is all but dried up.

I am not at all entitled to my opinion. That's just your stupid way of equalizing everything. You don't get to have an opinion on anything and have it be free from criticism simply because it's an opinion, moron.

You then reinterpret a judgment as a rudeness, just like how the religious man takes any slight against his god as a blasphemy. It's a stupid way of covering all the exits. "I have this ridiculous opinion and it's rude to contradict it and tell me the truth and you can't be rude."
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Tue Feb 03, 2009 9:14 pm

Advocatus Diaboli wrote:
See, now you try to gain favour with me by making a joke and referring to me as your 'mate'. It's not a bad tactic and I actually used to fall for it in the past; but, these days, my identification with and compassion for the weak and stupid is all but dried up."
I was trying to exit as gracefully as possible.
I responded to your first set of criticisms
If you had a presented a credible second rebuttal I would have responded.
If you want to represent Satan I would suggest more diplomacy. though that of course is an oxymoron.
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Wed Feb 11, 2009 12:39 pm

MM,, have you thought about the fact that we made the cows and chickens the way they are through eugneics. We took natural animals and bred unnatural animals. If we turn these unnatural animals into the ecosystem they will destroy the ecosystem. These creatures were bred to be food. Their existence would not be if it were not for our need to eat. They depend upon us for survival of their species as we depend upon theirs. The way they are slaughtered is grotesque but, feasabley there are zero ways to mass slaughter that are not grotesque. Life is a dirty business. Death is life, its all a process. We live they live, we die they die, they are tied to us in life and death because we bred them, not nature.
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Wed Feb 11, 2009 1:05 pm

kriswest wrote:
MM,, have you thought about the fact that we made the cows and chickens the way they are through eugneics. We took natural animals and bred unnatural animals. If we turn these unnatural animals into the ecosystem they will destroy the ecosystem. These creatures were bred to be food. Their existence would not be if it were not for our need to eat. They depend upon us for survival of their species as we depend upon theirs. The way they are slaughtered is grotesque but, feasabley there are zero ways to mass slaughter that are not grotesque. Life is a dirty business. Death is life, its all a process. We live they live, we die they die, they are tied to us in life and death because we bred them, not nature.

One can sympathize with your view up to point
but only if we raised these animals with care
and concern for their state of consciousness
and were then
profoundly respectful at their sacrifice
that is what being kosher is all about
but of course corporate profits would go to hell

Have you ever heard the screams in a abattoir?
Have you ever smelt the stench in the holding pens
when their realization of their impending death
turns their shit
to water?

Nature has Her revenge
of course
the poison of their curses
come with the meal
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Wed Feb 11, 2009 1:58 pm

MagnetMan wrote:


One can sympathize with your view up to point
but only if we raised these animals with care
and concern for their state of consciousness
and were then
profoundly respectful at their sacrifice
that is what being kosher is all about
but of course corporate profits would go to hell
Quote :
Kosher is not feasable. if butchering were only done Kosher, then supermarket prices would sky rocket, people could not afford to by food or the products that come from butchered animals,, Like dog food and cat food and assorted other items. It would hurt the average person not just corporate. If people have a pet dog or cat, they would have to get rid of them because they could not afford to feed them, scholl lunches would cost more. the list goes on and on.


Have you ever heard the screams in a abattoir?
Have you ever smelt the stench in the holding pens
when their realization of their impending death
turns their shit
to water?
Quote :
I have killed food animals and will again and again. I live in the country where butchering and killing food animals is normal. the smell is horrible, the sounds are nightmarish but,, you get used to it just as you get used to many pains in life.
Nature has Her revenge
of course
the poison of their curses
come with the meal
Nature kills and slaughters farm worse and more than man could ever do.
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Wed Feb 11, 2009 2:54 pm

MagnetMan wrote:
There is no way that I can detect that the video on the UTUBE link I give below may be faked in any way.
When you view it I think you will agree that it radically alters our consciousness as regards human relationships with Mother Nature.
The video shows a young elephant painting the portrait of an elephant
The execution of the painting, from start to its incredible final spiritual touch is as thoughtful and as masterful as anything a Picasso could produce.
It reveals a consciousness that, in essence, is no different from ours
The fact that I once hunted and killed them is freaking me out to a large extent.

There are no words I can use to describe the impact that the elephant drawing has had on my consciousness
In the space of ten minutes it altered my entire world view.
Just for starters, from a personal behavioral aspect it has immediately and radically altered my own attitude towards eating the flesh of any animal. I have suddenly and irrevocably become a vegetarian.
I now feel that commercial animal slaughter it is akin to murder, mass genocide in fact.
I would be greatly interested to know if it strikes anybody else the same way.
Here is the link again for those who have not seen it.

I would be greatly interested to know if it impacts anybody else as profoundly as it has me.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=He7Ge7Sogrk&e
Shit man, you are insane!!!

Picasso?!!!

This from a Christian believing animals were created for man.

I would hunt man with much more pleasure than I would an elephant or a deer or a squirrel.

Especially eon thinknig of itself so special that it deserves eternal life and a God watching over him.
Hunting such a creature would not only be pleasing but it would also cleanse the Earth from its filth.

If they ran and hid in one of their Cathedrals, praying for divine intervention, meditating to levitate out of there, that would make it even more fun.
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PostSubject: Re: Man & Beast - A Similar Consciousness   Wed Feb 11, 2009 6:05 pm

The amazing thing about the elephant's art, is that she drew it from an abstract single line starting from the trunk to the hind foot, inclined for perspective of it's elevation from the ground. Then repeated that incline again for the forefoot on the same side, The flower was incredible. Two daubs of paint, red on the tip and yellow on the body of the brush and she fan painted the flower head floating in space with a 'hot' center ... the whole image is a romantic ballet ... a dancing elephant. Divine inspiration? Perhaps, but one thing for certain, she painted like a pro ... no different than Picasso. Express the line ... fill in the details.

Of course it was the mahout
pulling invisible strings
that made her do it

On the other hand
maybe it was god pulling strings
that made the mahout pull strings
that made her do it

Check this out
http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=4696315n
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